Quickfires by Learner Mobile
Quickfires by Learner Mobile
Creating an Accountability Culture: What’s Love Got to Do With It?
Cultivating an effective organizational culture is a complex and intricate task. It involves balancing elements that at first glance, may seem contradictory - love and accountability. In this podcast episode, Sheryl Porter and Mike Thompson explore this dynamic balance and offer valuable insights on fostering a high-performance culture, imbued with empathy and accountability.
Quickfires is brought to you by Learner Mobile, the learning experience platform that delivers the right information at the perfect time so you can win your day. To simply develop everyone in your organization and start your free trial of Learner Mobile, go to learnermobile.com
引 Welcome to Quick Fires by Learner Mobile the podcast where we like the learning spark with skills, best practices and stories for leaders of learners. Make room fireside for your hosts, Sheryl Porter and Mike Thompson.
Speaker 1:Hi and welcome to the podcast. I'm Sheryl Porter, but you can call me SP, and I'm joined by Mike Thompson.
Speaker 2:Hey SP.
Speaker 1:You ready to jump into another?
Speaker 2:topic yes, I love this topic.
Speaker 1:Of best practices and stories for leaders of learners. Do you want to share what we're covering today?
Speaker 2:Yeah, this topic is on creating an accountability culture, and there's a little bit of a twist in this accountability culture. The question that we're going to pose is what does love got to do with it?
Speaker 1:It's got a lot to do with it and we have a plot twist. You don't have to wait till the end. We're going to give it to you a little bit early.
Speaker 2:Always.
Speaker 1:So why is this such a favorite topic of yours, Mike?
Speaker 2:I think a lot of companies, organizations, really struggle with this idea of accountability. I also think that we've started for a while. We've been shying more and more away from accountability. It wasn't that long ago when the perception was we worked for companies. That's right and now it seems like we've kind of moved a little bit more to companies work for us, and when we become the center, accountability may be a little bit tougher for us.
Speaker 1:Right and I have seen that pendulum swing pretty drastically and accountability has been top of mind. I think it will continue to be top of mind and it seems to be very elusive to a lot of company cultures out there and a new facet that's been entered into it is that top talent they have become very aware of culture and that's something that they're really seeking out, along with a benefits package and a retirement plan, along with that 401K and that salary. They're very interested in what the culture is in a perspective place of business that they want to work at.
Speaker 2:Sure, and great people want to work with organizations that have great performance. So if we want to tap into that top talent, I think we've got to be able to show that our organization is a culture of accountability committed to high performance.
Speaker 1:So in this episode we are going to talk a lot about how you can assess your organization where it stands today, who's doing it well and what it takes to get to an ideal state. So you're ready.
Speaker 2:I'm ready.
Speaker 1:Let's buckle up that plot twist that I teased. It's time for it. So what we wanted to share today is really our big headline is that creating an accountability culture means that it's not about accountability all the time, and that seems to go a little bit against what we've been ingrained with.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that's where the plot twist maybe comes in, with what love has to do with it. I think that if you're a culture of accountability, where accountability happens all the time, you probably got to be a little bit careful of that, because people in a high culture of accountability that happens all the time may get to a point where it's like man, I just feel like all that happens is I get beat up every day, I'm constantly challenged, I'm never encouraged, and so that's one side of the ditch. The other side of the ditch is these high love cultures, and in a high love culture sometimes those cultures lack accountability completely and it's a very soft organization. People are very shy to hold each other accountable. Those accountability conversations are really, really tough and people avoid them at all costs. Neither are good.
Speaker 2:When it's all accountability, that's bad. When it's all love, that's bad. So if you think about it in kind of an X and Y axis SP, let's say that high accountability is represented on that Y axis and high love is represented on that X axis. The best companies balance that right in the middle. So they take an arrow from the zeros on the X and Y axis and they put it at a 45 degree angle and the further they're up and that the better they're going to perform. So that's what we want to do is, when we think of a high accountability culture that is healthy and drives high performance, there's got to be that balance between those tough, challenging conversations and then those very encouraging, kind of love conversations.
Speaker 1:And I want to piggyback on that just a little further because, holistically, when you look at it overall, we do want to strike that balance between high love and high accountability. But I think we're setting our listeners up for failure if we expect them to slice that pie 50-50 day in and day out.
Speaker 2:Great point.
Speaker 1:There's going to be times where we have to swing a little bit deeper into the accountability part, and then there's other times where we need to flex those love skills.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you got to read the room right. We've talked about emotional intelligence in the past. It's really all about as a leader. Today, man, we've got to have great judgment. Got to have great judgment and sometimes that means we're going to be all in on accountability for a period of time because it's necessary. But, to your point, there's other times when we're going to need to be all in on all love because it's necessary. I think in the past SP we've talked about the idea of relationships being like a bank account deposits and withdrawals. I think if you're always accountability, that's a lot of withdrawals. If you're all about love, that's a lot of deposits, and a healthy bank account relational bank account has both. Same concept is occurring here.
Speaker 1:So let's take three scenarios, if you will, and we'll talk about the consequences of them. So let's take a scenario where you have a lot of love but low accountability. The consequences of that scenario is that it can be considered pretty self-indulgent because it's easy.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:You want to talk about comfort a little bit.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you're right, it is easy, and the danger is that we just default to that. And moving out of all love to more of a more balanced approach I guess requires that we leave that comfort zone sometimes. But if you sit in the love, I think it's easy, I think you can be comfortable, I even think you can get to a place of apathy. And that's the real danger is, if you have a culture that has become apathetic, you're in trouble, you're in trouble and then and you're not winning.
Speaker 1:That was the. The big headline for me is if you're all love and no accountability, we're not gonna get very far, we're not gonna make our goals, we're not gonna make our objectives, we're not going to grow and along with that, apathy is your top performers Are going to back off they ain't coming because there's no incentive for them right, yeah.
Speaker 1:Let's take another scenario. Let's turn it around 180. You're in a culture with high accountability and Low love. So some things that you're gonna see as a consequence of that is it's gonna be a culture of fears, a fear People are gonna lack competent. You'll probably expect a lot of turnover as well, because you're gonna win at least today, but you're gonna have a wake of debris in your path. The body counts gonna be quite high.
Speaker 2:Yeah, a lot of consequences with with that as well, and we know I mean. When we think about both of these cultures either High accountability and low love, or high love and low accountability we recognize these cultures. Both are consequential. One in the high love category means you're not Performing at your peak, you're not performing at your best when you're in that high accountability. I love your. I love your point about they lack confidence. That's the biggest danger. People show up every day and and they're walking on a tightrope without a net and at any moment they can just get knocked down and they expect to and it's gonna just zap the creativity and the innovation out of an organization yeah, there's a fear of.
Speaker 2:You use the word fear. Not only is there just how they fear emotionally, but there's a fear of failure. They have a fear of Failing. They feel like they can't fail or they're gonna, or it's gonna introduce a another Accountability conversation.
Speaker 1:Okay, let's talk about the perfect scenario. The ideal scenario, this is your X and Y axis with a strong 45 degree angle Slicing through it to where you have both love and you have accountability. So the consequence, the benefit of that Mixture, is you're going to just have high Engagement. People are gonna feel very purpose driven and connected to the team, the business and the outcome connected.
Speaker 2:They're they're connected to the team. They feel a sense of belonging, they feel like they fit, they feel like they're valued. But they don't stop there. They also feel invested in, they feel like they're challenged, they feel like they're getting better, they're improving, and so no wonder high performers really want to work for these kinds of organizations and I can think of a lot of these types of organizations and they're they're killing it.
Speaker 1:So let's talk about how a listener might be able to assess this, because they're hearing these Different attributes and they may be able to assimilate it to their current work situation. So if you were to do a quick Analysis of what to look for to see where you are on the line, if you're a 90 degree angle, a 45 degree angle, zero angle, somewhere in between- yeah guide us through it.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I think expectations are Critical for a company or an organization that is successfully balancing accountability and love well. So setting those expectations, reminding people of those expectations when you do that You're able to make tough conversations Unemotional. They're not so personal because why? They're all about the set expectations, they're all about the standard. They're not about the emotion. So good, healthy, challenging conversations are not emotional conversations.
Speaker 1:And when it comes to expectations, can everybody align on the expectation? Or, if you're surveying the room, is there misalignment in what our expectations are, what the goals are? I think that's critical is to have them, to be aligned on them and then act in a way that supports them.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's not a one-time deal. Setting expectations is a daily deal. So sure you can announce the expectations, you can even throw them up on a PowerPoint presentation, you can put them on a sign in the cafeteria. But you need to also make sure that you're repeating those expectations so people don't feel cheated, they don't feel like they're getting picked on Again. The conversation is about the standard that is set and everybody's aligned behind that it's like showing up and having a pop quiz.
Speaker 1:You want everybody to be prepared for it, so the opposite I would say something that goes along with it. It is a point under how to assess your organization is the results. You have expectations and then results. It really truly takes the emotion out of it, because it's not about might be in a terrible person. It's about did we meet the expectation? What results point to that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and are the accountability conversations about results or the accountability conversations about style? Hopefully they're more about the results than they are about the style. I'm not discounting style. Style is huge and I think you mentioned it a second ago. The wrong style can get the results but leave a trail of debris in their wake. We don't want that. But organizations that are so focused on the results and can have those accountability conversations around the results are going to be the best performers.
Speaker 2:I do have one more SP, and this one's really important to me. I think because I just fall in love with cultures that where accountability is not so heavy, it's not so weighted In some organizations. You see that those accountability conversations, people just they never look forward to them, they agonize over them. It's something that they're thinking about a week out and that's just. That's a problem. The best organizations that do this is those that they do it often. And when you do it often and when it's just a part of your everyday or your every week and it's not connected to drama or baggage, then those accountable conversations, those challenging conversations, can be light. And when we have, when accountability conversations just aren't a big deal in your organization, then you've hit the mark.
Speaker 1:And it doesn't become about the person, it becomes about the work, so it becomes more objective versus subjective. So we're talking about feedback, giving it, getting it and often and I always say up down and all around we want to create a culture of also transparency, where I can give you feedback, you can give me feedback. It is not this weighty thing that I've been carrying around on my shoulder all week and you're going to be professional and mature enough to take it and we can discuss it.
Speaker 2:It's not a one way street and, by the way, this isn't just topical for us. You and I live this. We do. We do every single day, and I can't count the number of feedback sessions you and I have had and where we've challenged each other. You challenged me a ton.
Speaker 2:I've challenged you a ton A ton and and I think there's so there's such mutual respect there. I care enough to receive your feedback and I care enough to give you feedback and vice versa, and that's really that. That kind of reflects back on having the proper balance between high accountability and high love. It's really about do you have the courage to hold people accountable and do you care enough for them and their success to to provide that feedback. So so, courage to give it and care enough to give it. Make sure that you're approaching accountability with the right mindset, and I really value that about our organization.
Speaker 1:I do too, and it's something that I've always accepted. But I really look forward to it, because when it becomes a habit and it's not just once in a blue moon, it's done daily or weekly it doesn't become heavy, it's something light, it's something that you look forward to, and then you begin to seek out.
Speaker 2:You know, it's really bad. I think, and we work with a lot of organizations that we help usher through this process, creating that culture of accountability, but so many organizations will will have the accountability feedback kind of conversations once a year during the what.
Speaker 1:Performance review.
Speaker 2:Performance review, absolutely so. So if that's your culture, you got to change it. That's not going to be effective. It can't. Those feedback sessions can't take place one time a year, they've got to take place one or two times a week, and that's how you're driving that culture of accountability.
Speaker 1:So let's talk about somebody who's doing it. Well, if you listen to our podcast about customer service, part of our service points that are important to us is celebrating like a pageant mom. I'm gonna celebrate like a pageant mom for just a moment, so please indulge me. I wanna give a little bit of client love to BSN Sports. They're part of varsity brands and if you have ever had someone in your family play elementary club, junior, high, high school, collegiate sports, you've probably written a check to BSN Sports.
Speaker 2:Once in your lifetime.
Speaker 1:you've got a son in high school so who plays football, so you've been probably writing a lot of checks to BSN Sports.
Speaker 2:I've written a lot of checks to BSN Sports. That's right. They're a great company.
Speaker 1:And when it comes to creating that accountability culture from all the companies I've seen they really do it the best and they make it look effortless and they are accountable. They have this culture but it's not this weighty thing. It is just as natural to them as breathing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that they're such a great example. The things that I admire about the culture of accountability that BSN has established is you're right, it's not weighty and it can't be weighty, but feedback, accountability for them does flow in all directions. Everybody gets it, no one is immune. Note, from the top all the way to the bottom. Everyone gets it. And I think that it's just part of their continuous improvement culture and they value it. Sp, they seek out feedback at all levels. And then the other thing that I really admire about what they do in their culture is it's just not emotional, it's not personal. As a matter of fact, if you don't give it, you start to worry what's wrong.
Speaker 1:There is just a huge amount of respect they have for themselves, each other, their organizations and the coaches that they serve. I see it day in and day out how they really share the glory, and I think there's this concept out there that if you're shining, that means I'm shattered, and if you really look on a case by case basis, I don't think that's ever been true. We both can shine. Your shine does not dull mine at all, and I see that day in and day out with this company. So you may ask what makes them different. I do have a little bit of a story to tell. This isn't scientific, it's just my observation. But since they are in the sporting field, I think that people who are attracted to this organization, people they hire for this organization, they have a background in sports and think about any time that you've played any kind of group activity from a very early age. You learn how to be on a team, how to play a specific role and how to show up for somebody else and how to take and give feedback.
Speaker 2:And win together. That's right, and those people who have been involved in sports at an early age and then work for. They've lived a life of learning how to win together and that means that it's culture, that means that they have an affiliation to BSN because that's the culture that they grew up in.
Speaker 1:So I have a quick list for you, cause I love a good pun and I'm not sorry about it at all. So how do they just do it? They are quick to recognize, quick to address. They don't agonize on issues. So what I mean by that is they spend the right amount of time on the right issues that really make a difference. They celebrate the wins together and they debrief the losses together.
Speaker 2:Yeah, love, that I mean. That's the formula right. There is just that there's no delay, there's no weight, it's just every bit a part of their day-to-day activity. So great example SP of BSN Sports and we've certainly learned a lot from them and just observing their culture and having the great opportunity to work with them and support them. So the question I have is what does it take to get there? And for me I think you've gotta have and we talked about this a little bit earlier.
Speaker 2:But there are two things that you've gotta have in a culture of accountability and your leadership. One is courage. You've gotta have enough courage to be okay with having challenging conversations, corrective conversations, improvement conversations, and to a lot of people those just aren't comfortable. They're never comfortable doing it once, they're never comfortable doing it a second time, but when you've done it 36 times it gets really comfortable and it just becomes part of the natural flow. So that's the courage side, but the other side is the care.
Speaker 2:So if we kinda look at that X and Y axis again, where you've got accountability on the Y axis and love on the X axis, courage really is associated with accountability, conversations and then care is associated with the love side of that, the X axis, but I think they both work well together. In fact, my question is do you have the courage to really care? If they're all easy, soft, encouraging conversations, all the time, I start to wonder if you even care about me. Because I want honesty, I want the truth. I'm okay with being a little bit vulnerable, and I know you're okay with being a little bit vulnerable and I know you care enough about me to tell me when, I have a blind spot.
Speaker 2:So I think that there's this care aspect that is also associated with giving feedback, because you're interested and invested in my growth and my improvement, so have the courage to have those conversations and care enough.
Speaker 1:And if being empathetic is not natural to you, I think it's not only care about your coworker or your peer, it's caring about your company and caring about your customers. So we joked around how we don't like the saying fake it till you make it, but maybe fake it until you become it, Until you place yourself in a state where you can really empathize and care for the other person.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's probably sometimes, when you have very real baggage in a relationship, maybe you feel let down, maybe you have a trust challenge, and what do you do with that? Because does that mean just accountability must stop, feedback must stop.
Speaker 1:You gotta put it in the overhead bin.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you've got, and I think it's okay to even acknowledge it in the conversations. Hey, I know we've had some of our struggles. I know that we're working on improving our relationship, but you know what. You matter enough for me to go there, and so I'm just gonna confess right out of the gate that I've got some baggage. But I'm gonna commit to setting this off to the side because you're too important to me and us winning together is something that I'm really eager to see happen. That I'm gonna confess it. I'm gonna put it to the side, but I'm gonna have the courage to have that conversation with you and I hope we can get to a different place in our relationship, and I think we can if we're vulnerable enough to accept it and we're courageous enough to share it.
Speaker 1:Love it All right, you ready for some quick fire takeaways?
Speaker 2:Yeah, let's do it.
Speaker 1:Always All right. So number one is evaluate your current culture. I think we gave some examples of if you fall too much on the love side, too much on the accountability side, or are you soaring at that 45 degree angle that we aspire to?
Speaker 2:And you brought up a good point early on and so I think that there's two graphs that we need to look at here. There's the X and the Y graph, to where we're trying to meet that 45 degree angle, but there is this continuum, too, that you mentioned, and you're never in one side or the other all the time. You're constantly maneuvering back and forth between that continuum, leaning more on accountability on occasion, more on love on occasion, and that's just where emotional intelligence can come in.
Speaker 1:Yeah, stay out of the ditches y'all. Number two is do you give and get feedback regularly? So there's a lot to unpack here and I'll do it quick. So regularly is daily or weekly basis. If you're not getting it every week, I think you may want to rethink your strategy there. And then also it's getting feedback as well as giving feedback, and for some people, if the culture is high accountability and low love, this could be scary. So we do have a couple of tips, a little phrases, to take with you. So if you are looking to gain feedback, which I recommend you do that first.
Speaker 2:Sure.
Speaker 1:Because it's. I think it's easy to tell people what they need to work on. It's really hard to hear what people think of. You is just simply asking what feedback do you have? There's no personal emotion in that phrase, so what feedback do you have?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's safe, isn't it? It's safe, it's simple, and you're saying I'm open to it.
Speaker 1:When it's your turn to give feedback. Here is a phrase that has served me well, and it would sound something like this Mike, are you open to a suggestion?
Speaker 2:Love it.
Speaker 1:Nobody yet has said no.
Speaker 2:And you've given a lot of them.
Speaker 1:I do, I do. And then also, what is your motive when giving the feedback, really thinking back to what Mike said about having the courage to care.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, I think motive is key in a good feedback session. You've got to have the right heart position.
Speaker 1:And then our last takeaway for today is leave that baggage behind, check it at the ticket counter or stow it in the overhead bin, because people who struggle with accountability feel that weight for a number of reasons, whether they feel like they're getting beat up all the time or put it aside, yeah for sure. And finally, point number three is leaving that baggage behind, so check it out the ticket gate, stow it in the overhead bin. We know that people who really struggle with accountability feel the weight of it for a number of reasons. So I've said it once, I'll say it again clear your cash and cookies and proceed with that conversation.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I love that that illustration of just clearing your cash Just show up brand new in the conversation and I'm really excited that hopefully this can stir some people that are struggling with those feedback sessions and accountability conversations. Just a few tips to elevate their relationships and elevate their performance.
Speaker 1:Well, that wraps up today's episode Creating an Accountability Culture. If you like what you heard today, share us with a colleague and make sure you subscribe so you don't miss a single episode.
Speaker 2:Quick Fires is brought to you by Cheryl Porter.
Speaker 1:And Mike Thompson, Thanks for listening. Quick Fires is brought to you by Learner Mobile, the learning experience platform that delivers the right information at the perfect time so you can win your day. To simply develop everyone in your organization and start your free trial of Learner Mobile, go to LearnerMobilecom. And now back to the podcast.
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